What's Next for JWF?

[Jojogunne]

Now that his amateur career is over, does Justin Wright-Foreman leave school early to prepare for the NBA draft (June 19)?

https://www.nba.com/draft#/

Will he train with Jason Hernandez's company or somewhere else?

https://www.prohoopsnyc.com/

Will he get to play in the Portsmouth Invitation or the new G-League Elite Camp?

https://www.portsmouthinvitational.com/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jefffeld/2 ... c1e7596dfe

Here's one mock draft. Hard to believe there are 60 players better than Justin (even the mighty Shamorie Ponds, ranked 59th, doesn't get any respect here):

https://www.nbadraft.net/2019mock_draft

[Polito]

Not surprised at all, called it actually - dance and he goes first round - falter like they did and his stock sinks... that's just kinda the way it works. BUT I do still believe he gets drafted. SO many scouts followed him, they know what he brings.

Tremendous scorer all levels, but a bit undersized and plays weak D. If he can ball out in whatever he's able to do leading up to the day to rise up that board a bit more...

[Flying Dutchmen]

I'm not saying there's no chance he gets drafted, but I think it's unlikely. I think he goes G-League, for a year or two, then a good Europe career a la Jenkins, Uter, Juan'ya

[HUSID74]

Not surprised at all, called it actually - dance and he goes first round - falter like they did and his stock sinks... that's just kinda the way it works. BUT I do still believe he gets drafted. SO many scouts followed him, they know what he brings.

Tremendous scorer all levels, but a bit undersized and plays weak D. If he can ball out in whatever he's able to do leading up to the day to rise up that board a bit more...

His draft status has nothing to do with a one and done in the NCAA's. If he had a Curry run, that's different but his draft status will now depend on Portsmouth and other post season events.

[Wags]

Not surprised at all, called it actually - dance and he goes first round - falter like they did and his stock sinks... that's just kinda the way it works. BUT I do still believe he gets drafted. SO many scouts followed him, they know what he brings.

Tremendous scorer all levels, but a bit undersized and plays weak D. If he can ball out in whatever he's able to do leading up to the day to rise up that board a bit more...

His draft status has nothing to do with a one and done in the NCAA's. If he had a Curry run, that's different but his draft status will now depend on Portsmouth and other post season events.

Yeah, skills are skills. After three full college seasons, you know what a player was in college and what his NBA potential might be based on that. You're a pretty bad NBA GM if after seeing JWF on film and/or in person over three years, you decide to draft him simply because Hofstra beat Northeastern in the CAA finals or decide not to draft him after his team loses that one game.

Ben Simmons had a chance to reach the NCAAT but didn't get it done, and his school declined to play in the NIT. Should he not have been drafted?

Johnny Flynn had a terrific Big East tournament, leading Syracuse on an unlikely run. Did it justify him being picked as high as 6th, one spot ahead of Steph Curry?

[Polito]

His draft status has nothing to do with a one and done in the NCAA's.

Incorrect. It absolutely does. It provides a national stage, continued and increased national attention and media, another opp to go toe to toe with a quality-big time P5.

If you think Speedy would've gone 1st round without making the dance, you're off your rocker. That alone catapulted him there. Even then most didn't believe he would - I recall vividly having discussions with people claiming that he would...now. And the team didn't win, but he played well and further showcased is skill on the biggest stage.

Fletcher Magee from Wofford will continue to raise his stock there. He was already a national record setter from 3, but this tourney will immortalize him. And considering they actually win big games, and just landed an NCAAT win, only gonna raise his stock more.

Also just another case that proves the CAA itself is useless and overrated. Another small time school from a basic mid major conf showing how it's done. While the mighty NU, who was clearly better than HU, got housed by 30. Yeah, KU different than SHU, but still you get the point here. The CAA does nothing except make it unnecessarily difficult to dance. And the teams aren't any more prepared than any other solid mid conf/team.

HU and the CAA have a LOT to learn about winning this college hoops 'game' in the national landscape.


FD, yeah, you certainly may be right and the odds are likely against him - I do think he goes, but would not be surprised if he doesn't.

[cactus]

Agree with Polito here. Look at the exposure Ja Morant is getting right now. If Wright Foreman put up 37 pts for example even in a loss he'd be on a lot more radars.

[stuball888]

As good a college player JWF is I see Europe in his future. Unless he absolutely wows them in Portsmith I blame partially the CAA. If we are an elite midmajor why don’t we have a TV contract. Even regionally we should have a couple of games each week plus at least woman’s game. What is this commissioner doing to earn his pay

[dutchiedoright]

It really doesn't matter.....If you can play, they'll (NBA) find you.

Ja has been on the NBA radar for a while. He has been projected to be an early first round pick.

Scouts make mistakes for sure, but if you can play, you'll get there. If you were playing in college at a high level and cant play, the league will flush you out too.

[HUSID74]

His draft status has nothing to do with a one and done in the NCAA's.

Incorrect. It absolutely does. It provides a national stage, continued and increased national attention and media, another opp to go toe to toe with a quality-big time P5.

If you think Speedy would've gone 1st round without making the dance, you're off your rocker. That alone catapulted him there. Even then most didn't believe he would - I recall vividly having discussions with people claiming that he would...now. And the team didn't win, but he played well and further showcased is skill on the biggest stage.

Fletcher Magee from Wofford will continue to raise his stock there. He was already a national record setter from 3, but this tourney will immortalize him. And considering they actually win big games, and just landed an NCAAT win, only gonna raise his stock more.

Also just another case that proves the CAA itself is useless and overrated. Another small time school from a basic mid major conf showing how it's done. While the mighty NU, who was clearly better than HU, got housed by 30. Yeah, KU different than SHU, but still you get the point here. The CAA does nothing except make it unnecessarily difficult to dance. And the teams aren't any more prepared than any other solid mid conf/team.




HU and the CAA have a LOT to learn about winning this college hoops 'game' in the national landscape.


FD, yeah, you certainly may be right and the odds are likely against him - I do think he goes, but would not be surprised if he doesn't.

Too many abosultes and incorrects on these boards...no one here is ABSOLUTELY CORRECT...jUST LOOK AT CHARLES JENKINS, second round pick from the school that always "underachieves."

[HUSID74]

Agree with Polito here. Look at the exposure Ja Morant is getting right now. If Wright Foreman put up 37 pts for example even in a loss he'd be on a lot more radars.

JA is a lottery pick....apples and oranges here...and he would have been a lottery pick even if he didn't go to the dance.
Justin's most important pre-draft worry is to EXCEL in Portsmouth...that's where it will be determined where he winds up.

[EvanJ]

Not surprised at all, called it actually - dance and he goes first round - falter like they did and his stock sinks... that's just kinda the way it works. BUT I do still believe he gets drafted. SO many scouts followed him, they know what he brings.

Tremendous scorer all levels, but a bit undersized and plays weak D. If he can ball out in whatever he's able to do leading up to the day to rise up that board a bit more...

His draft status has nothing to do with a one and done in the NCAA's. If he had a Curry run, that's different but his draft status will now depend on Portsmouth and other post season events.

Yeah, skills are skills. After three full college seasons, you know what a player was in college and what his NBA potential might be based on that. You're a pretty bad NBA GM if after seeing JWF on film and/or in person over three years, you decide to draft him simply because Hofstra beat Northeastern in the CAA finals or decide not to draft him after his team loses that one game.

It's not about GMs thinking he's worse because he didn't play in the NCAA Tournament. It's GMs who won't draft the best mid-major player in the country if he didn't play in the NCAA Tournament. Unfortunately, it's also about fans and PR. If two players were going to play equally poorly in the NBA and be obvious mistakes, GMs would still draft the player from the better conference because that's what fans want. There are things the media and fans can do that unintentionally make a team that the media and fans want to win do worse on the field, court, or ice. Take MLB free agency. Before the season, teams get judged on how much money they spent in the offseason. The media and fans don't focus on those players' combined contributions last year or projections for this year. Especially with teams like the Yankees who have a lot of revenue, the media and fans may take the position of "when in doubt, spend money." To NBA GMs, it's "when in doubt, draft the player more fans know." Imperfect selection of employees is true in any career. If a job is done by thousands or millions of people around the country, inevitably there are some people who applied a bunch of times without getting a job in that industry and gave up who could have done better than many people working in that industry.

[Polito]

Fair enough HUSID, really didn't mean to say it in the absolute term, but fair callout - I should say you are still incorrect, it CAN play a big factor - so you saying it has nothing to do with it is also an absolute, and therefore off


Wags, you NAILED it - I think my comments are being misunderstood, my fault. What I'm saying is not that the dance would determine a player getting drafted, although it can also, but I think it plays a BIG part in just how high some of the mid major ones that do will go.

I'm sorry, but you cannot tell me that Speedy goes 1st round without the NCAAT appearance. We can't prove it, so sure it can be argued, but I will not believe for one second that he goes like 22nd or whatever it was. What GM is going to pull that 1st round trigger with a small school guy from a joke conf, I mean c'mon. That appearance made him in the eyes of the NBA folks, even if it was only because of exactly what Wags just said.

This is about perception - draft a guy that balled out in the NCAAT is fine for most teams/fan bases, but do that for an NIT guy from a small program, and I'm sorry but they will be defending that move.

Are there exceptions? Of course. Jenkins was def one, but he also had decent size, something JWF does not have, the CAA was much more respected at that time, and he was clearly the best player in the league/tri-state/etc. If JWF doesn't win the Haggerty, missing the NCAAT with more chances to shine against a big might be a bigger factor than some want to admit. Being in the dance helps justify a lot of things. Right or wrong.

[Wags]

It's not about GMs thinking he's worse because he didn't play in the NCAA Tournament. It's GMs who won't draft the best mid-major player in the country if he didn't play in the NCAA Tournament. Unfortunately, it's also about fans and PR. If two players were going to play equally poorly in the NBA and be obvious mistakes, GMs would still draft the player from the better conference because that's what fans want. There are things the media and fans can do that unintentionally make a team that the media and fans want to win do worse on the field, court, or ice. Take MLB free agency. Before the season, teams get judged on how much money they spent in the offseason. The media and fans don't focus on those players' combined contributions last year or projections for this year. Especially with teams like the Yankees who have a lot of revenue, the media and fans may take the position of "when in doubt, spend money." To NBA GMs, it's "when in doubt, draft the player more fans know." Imperfect selection of employees is true in any career. If a job is done by thousands or millions of people around the country, inevitably there are some people who applied a bunch of times without getting a job in that industry and gave up who could have done better than many people working in that industry.

Indiana Pacers fans were once furious at Donnie Walsh for drafting Reggie Miller over hometown favorite Steve Alford.

That's why smart GMs do what they believe is right and not worry about what the fans want.

[EvanJ]

Miller played for UCLA, not a mid-major, and given that he was drafted 11th I think everybody knew before the draft that he would be drafted. That example is just fans of one team. In an alternate world where nobody talked about how well a team drafted until after the players played in the NBA or were sent to the G League, it would be better for mid-majors. If a GM drafts a player from a top conference who doesn't do well in the NBA, people will make these excuses that they wouldn't make for a mid-major player:

1. It was the player's fault for not doing well in the NBA, or it was the fault of his coach or teammates, but drafting him wasn't a poor decision.

2. Not all college stars do well in the pros. While this is true, saying it helps players in the top conferences. If Zion Williamson and Ja Morant both stink in the NBA, it will hurt the perception of mid-major players but won't hurt the perception of players in the top conferences. An analogy is that if a firm hires a new lawyer from Harvard and a new lawyer from Hofstra, them both being bad lawyers could make the firm skeptical of Hofstra graduates, but wouldn't make the firm not want more Ivy Leaguers.

3. His college stats weren't as good as people thought. Even if the statements about his college stats made after he failed in the NBA are true, it's wrong to make statements about college stats that a person wouldn't have made if the player did better in the pros. College stats don't get better or worse after a player goes to the pros.

[Wags]

Miller played for UCLA, not a mid-major, and given that he was drafted 11th I think everybody knew before the draft that he would be drafted.

Uh, yeah. Well aware, thanks.

Proves the point even more though. Miller was that highly regarded, yet misguided Pacer fans still wanted Alford. Still a good example of why good GMs do what's smart over listening to fans.

[EvanJ]

How many GMs are good? You can't rely on GMs to be good just like you don't leave your house unlocked and rely on nobody wanting to steal. How many GMs would rank JWF as one of the top 60 players who want to drafted if they had to rank the players without thinking about what their team needs, but when their picks come along they have players who they think are better than JWF. As a group, who GMs prefer isn't transitive. If a majority of GMs would draft Player X over Player Y, and a majority of GMs would draft Player Y over Player Z, it doesn't guarantee that a majority of GMs would draft Player X over Player Z. If JWF is available and the 60th and final pick is somebody else, it doesn't help JWF if most of the other GMs think the team with the 60th pick would have been better off drafting JWF than whoever the team picked.

ESPN's Top 100 players who want to be drafted dropped JWF from 64th the previous time I checked to 71st. Shamorie Ponds is 46th in the Mock Draft thinking about what team has each pick and 51st in the Top 100 without regards to what individual teams want. If it's any consolation, ESPN's Top 100 ranks JWF ahead of Markus Howard, who averaged 25.0 points and 3.9 assists for Marquette.

[Wags]

How many GMs are good? You can't rely on GMs to be good just like you don't leave your house unlocked and rely on nobody wanting to steal.

That's, um... some analogy.

[Flying Dutchmen]

I'm sorry, but you cannot tell me that Speedy goes 1st round without the NCAAT appearance. We can't prove it, so sure it can be argued, but I will not believe for one second that he goes like 22nd or whatever it was. What GM is going to pull that 1st round trigger with a small school guy from a joke conf, I mean c'mon. That appearance made him in the eyes of the NBA folks, even if it was only because of exactly what Wags just said.

This is about perception - draft a guy that balled out in the NCAAT is fine for most teams/fan bases, but do that for an NIT guy from a small program, and I'm sorry but they will be defending that move.

A NCAA run might have helped JWF's stock, but considering he played pretty well in the CAAT/NIT, I think he kind of showed what he is as a player, for better or worse. For the NCAAT to have made an impact on his draft stock, he would almost have to be a different player than he is, which is an undersized 2 guard. Just getting to the dance and getting smoked like Northeastern did would have done nothing for him, even if he scored 30 points. I definitely agree it helped Speedy, but that was also 20 years ago, and he was a true PG with elite athleticism.

I just think the fact that JWF's undersized, not a PG, and doesn't defend well overshadows his elite shooting ability, at least in the world of the NBA draft. Evan is right though, it only takes one GM to draft JWF, but I don't see it as a PR thing, a 2nd round draft pick doesn't elicit much interest from fans of an NBA team, even the ones who closely follow their teams. The second round is kind of a wasteland, lots of guys are drafted as international lottery tickets or drafted for G-League rosters.

I think if he can show in the next few months that his athleticism translates better on the defensive side than it's showed, he has a shot to get drafted. But I think it's more likely that he goes undrafted into G-League and gets his NBA shot that way. Personally I think he's talented enough to get into the league, even if it's just for a year or two, but I have a hard time seeing him as a NBA starter unless he gets better defensively, and can show his PG skills work with top-talent.

[HUSID74]

If he goes to the NBA he won't be asked to score 30 every night...I think he will play better defense because he will see more limited minutes and there will be less pressure to put up big numbers.

Key for him will be to show he can score coming off the bench, something he hasn't had to do.