Game#23 vs Elon

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garyg
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by garyg »

Coaching staff must be held accountable...they recruit these players and usually hang on to 2 or 3 scholarships leaving us with short bench every season...they supposedly develop these players...and they are responsible for the game coaching....it all falls on them HUSID80....they run the entire show so the responsibility of putting a competitive product on the floor is their's
HUSID80
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by HUSID80 »

Did you ever think that the school is not letting us carry a full roster of 13 scholarship players for economic reasons...why have we not have had a full roster in years. And for all of you criticizing the staff for Walker's development should give them credit for taking a shot with Sabety and helping make him a force in the CAA from a Tufts...it goes both ways guys.
garyg
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by garyg »

JAM has difficulty with scholarships 10-13 because he can not sell those recruits on PT....he needs to sell those recruits on the other things and let them know if they work hard and develop playing time will not be an issue down the road...other schools do it...also if school is not allowing program to use all 13 scholarships that is not a good sign for program...do you know something we do not know HUSID80 ?
ZMAN3
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by ZMAN3 »

I gave us little or no chance to win this game without RG and EP - just not enough depth or talent. What I don't understand is JM's choice of defense. I've been saying all along they should try some "man" and all season they've used it next to nothing. Today, when they really needed to play zone due to lack of depth - he plays man. I realize Elon destroyed our zone last time but realizing his team would/should be gassed or in foul trouble some time in H2 zone was the only way to go. Not only doesn't he use it as the base defense for this game - he doesn't use it at all! - Even when we were in foul trouble and he needed to protect some players. They attacked JWF on a number of plays and he just let them go - and then finally fouled out. How could he not try it ?
As for Walker's cameo - they had him playing a 6'7" forward who took him outside and then went right around him. He has no business guarding someone 20' from the basket. If they were to play 2 bigs as some have proposed - it should be in zone! And if Walker hasn't developed - this is clearly on coaching staff. CJ Gettys without an athletic bone in his body gets minutes for Rutgers - he suks as does RU but he gets PT - Walker should have learned something by now that would get him on the court!
ZMAN3
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by ZMAN3 »

HUSID80 wrote:Did you ever think that the school is not letting us carry a full roster of 13 scholarship players for economic reasons...why have we not have had a full roster in years. And for all of you criticizing the staff for Walker's development should give them credit for taking a shot with Sabety and helping make him a force in the CAA from a Tufts...it goes both ways guys.
I like Sabety but exactly what is he ? A tremendous athlete who should be playing football - tight end or DE. What have they developed ? - he has no moves, no shot, can't shoot FT's - He can run, jump, rebound a little, block shots and dunk! Didn't exactly shut his man out either (not to mention committing 2 fouls in first 5 minutes hampering team when he should know he needed to stay on the court)
HUSID80
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by HUSID80 »

ZMAN3 wrote:I gave us little or no chance to win this game without RG and EP - just not enough depth or talent. What I don't understand is JM's choice of defense. I've been saying all along they should try some "man" and all season they've used it next to nothing. Today, when they really needed to play zone due to lack of depth - he plays man. I realize Elon destroyed our zone last time but realizing his team would/should be gassed or in foul trouble some time in H2 zone was the only way to go. Not only doesn't he use it as the base defense for this game - he doesn't use it at all! - Even when we were in foul trouble and he needed to protect some players. They attacked JWF on a number of plays and he just let them go - and then finally fouled out. How could he not try it ?
As for Walker's cameo - they had him playing a 6'7" forward who took him outside and then went right around him. He has no business guarding someone 20' from the basket. If they were to play 2 bigs as some have proposed - it should be in zone! And if Walker hasn't developed - this is clearly on coaching staff. CJ Gettys without an athletic bone in his body gets minutes for Rutgers - he suks as does RU but he gets PT - Walker should have learned something by now that would get him on the court!
They switched to man to man against Elon in the second half of the first game and it helped them get back into the game was Speedy's explanation in the pre-game talk...both of Elon's bigs can score from outside...so desperate measures for desperate times...
HUSID80
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by HUSID80 »

ZMAN3 wrote:
HUSID80 wrote:Did you ever think that the school is not letting us carry a full roster of 13 scholarship players for economic reasons...why have we not have had a full roster in years. And for all of you criticizing the staff for Walker's development should give them credit for taking a shot with Sabety and helping make him a force in the CAA from a Tufts...it goes both ways guys.
I like Sabety but exactly what is he ? A tremendous athlete who should be playing football - tight end or DE. What have they developed ? - he has no moves, no shot, can't shoot FT's - He can run, jump, rebound a little, block shots and dunk! Didn't exactly shut his man out either (not to mention committing 2 fouls in first 5 minutes hampering team when he should know he needed to stay on the court)
I guess you were not watching the same guy...he has VERY good post moves, has a little hook shot around the rim and gets off his fee QUICKLY...Oh and by the way shoots free throws about 3 times better than our other big...I think he's somewhere around 60%. If Rok shot 60% we would have at least two more CAA wins
ZMAN3
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by ZMAN3 »

I know they switched to man in the lst game - I pointed it out then and advocated using it more - BUT with the limited personnel they couldn't stay man Sat - there came a time when they had to switch (foul trouble, fatigue) and he never tried.
I know Sabety is a terrific athlete but shooting 60% from the foul line is no great accomplishment. I haven't seen this little hook (or don't remember it) but he has no jumper - unheard of in this era!
Mike34
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by Mike34 »

60% FT shooting is an accomplishment to me considering the horrendous shooting of Gustys this entire season ZMAN3. Also, Sabety can block - and isn't afraid to do it - which is rare in this conference. In the game Saturday against Elon he had some blocks/defense that did not cause him to foul which was great to see. And also, commenting on his two fouls in the first 5 minutes is a low-blow considering we can all agree that the refs were insane and one of those fouls was total BS. At least Sabety takes the fouls with dignity instead of storming around with smoke blowing out of his ears.

Also, feel bad for Walker that clearly he has not been trained well at all by the coaching staff. To have a 6'10" guy sit on the bench the entire season, I would have hoped the coaches planned to use him at some point. Also, like mentioned above, Mihalic did not use the two bigs together well AT ALL. Two bigs should be together in the zone, and at one point JM had both of them on the outside at the same time. Let's hope this doesn't count as JM's test-run of "playing two bigs together" since I think Rokas and Sabety together could make a tremendous impact IF the coach learns how to utilize them together properly.
ProudofPride
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by ProudofPride »

Considering the team as a whole only averages 67% FT shooting, Sabety's 60% doesn't seem all that bad. His free throw shooting is pretty low on the list of concerns for the team at this point. His is a valuable player on the court when he's not in foul trouble. I completely agree with Mike34 that we need his shot blocking and defense.
Polito
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by Polito »

I think JM and his staffs ability to utilize their rosters properly and use the right plan of attack/defense for the opponent or game situation has become a major glaring question.

And I don't see any positive answers to those questions.
Polito
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by Polito »

And depth is NOT an excuse this season, sorry. Absolutely not accepting that. That is total BS.

HU was 2 deep at EVERY position to start the season. For the first time I can remember in who knows how long. This was identified by ALL as a non-issue for the first time in JM's era. Not gonna start using that now to explain why they are a trainwreck this season.

Not allowing that. NO ONE should accept that or even attempt to use it.

Buie went down, unfortunately that happens - but he was only getting half or less min anyway, so still not the excuse. They decided to RS Trueheart and put all their 4 chips in to Greer.

He has stunk, so that has hurt big time. But his disappointing play isn't related to depth.

This ain't depth. It's the proper use and development of it. And THAT is coaching.

Pulling hard for these guys players AND staff, but the red flags are glaring and cannot be ignored any longer. They are front and center, and this staff is on the hook to improve, end of story.
ZMAN3
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by ZMAN3 »

As I said - if you pay attention to the post - I like Sabety - I'd like him to play more (thought for the most part he's playing as well or better than RG) BUT I'm not giving the coaching staff any credit for developing a player who's just playing on his athleticism - he had that upon his arrival. Developing some moves or refining his jumper (which is non existent) would be more of an indication of player development. Re the fouls collected early - first one was ticky tack but the 2nd was dumb - he needed to realize he had to stay on the court!
HUSID80
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by HUSID80 »

Polito wrote:And depth is NOT an excuse this season, sorry. Absolutely not accepting that. That is total BS.

HU was 2 deep at EVERY position to start the season. For the first time I can remember in who knows how long. This was identified by ALL as a non-issue for the first time in JM's era. Not gonna start using that now to explain why they are a trainwreck this season.

Not allowing that. NO ONE should accept that or even attempt to use it.

Buie went down, unfortunately that happens - but he was only getting half or less min anyway, so still not the excuse. They decided to RS Trueheart and put all their 4 chips in to Greer.

He has stunk, so that has hurt big time. But his disappointing play isn't related to depth.

This ain't depth. It's the proper use and development of it. And THAT is coaching.

Pulling hard for these guys players AND staff, but the red flags are glaring and cannot be ignored any longer. They are front and center, and this staff is on the hook to improve, end of story.
There is no depth when both threes [Robinson and Greer] give you nothing...three points against Elon I think, we have no back up point guard and a 6-11 guy who is clueless on the court...and that's not counting how long Rok and Eli will be sidelined.
HUSID80
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by HUSID80 »

ZMAN3 wrote:As I said - if you pay attention to the post - I like Sabety - I'd like him to play more (thought for the most part he's playing as well or better than RG) BUT I'm not giving the coaching staff any credit for developing a player who's just playing on his athleticism - he had that upon his arrival. Developing some moves or refining his jumper (which is non existent) would be more of an indication of player development. Re the fouls collected early - first one was ticky tack but the 2nd was dumb - he needed to realize he had to stay on the court!

And as I said he came from a D2 school with no confidence to play D1, very raw, undisciplined and could only dunk. If you saw him a year ago in practice, as I have, vs. now he has improved tremendously. Just sayin.
Last edited by HUSID80 on Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
Mike34
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by Mike34 »

Tufts is actually D3 - but anyways, Sabety is extremely athletic and he proved on Saturday that if he can stay out of foul trouble he should be in the game for more than an average of 11 mins.
stuball888
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by stuball888 »

John if the school is not allowing us to carry 13 scholarship players due to economic reasons, does that mean mens basketball is not fully funded?
HUSID80
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by HUSID80 »

I can understand holding back one scholarship every year in case we uncover a great transfer but if you look at our roster over the past several years I don't think we have had a full complement of 13 scholarship players in the program...why is that? I think all told, we have 11 in the program currently.
stuball888
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by stuball888 »

Yes John 11 with one redshirt included in that total(trueheart). We lose two next year with only one verbal. Its the following year when we lose 5 to graduation the scares the hell out of us.
Polito
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Re: Game#23 vs Elon

Post by Polito »

HUSID, agree fully that the 3/4 spots have not produced, been pretty bad actually, but that is NOT depth - that is performance. Two very different things.

HU had PLENTY of depth to start this season, that is absolutely not an excuse for this year. Both the bodies and talent were there on paper. Some KEY guys have not performed up to par, that is the issue, not depth.

The other one is the way this staff has used them - they have absolutely failed at putting the pieces together and utilizing the roster in an effective way to perform.

10th is not 6th. Yes, there are still games to be played, but as I said before, where are the W's going to come from?

And if that's the bar, then so be it. This team best finish at least 6th, or there is no denying the failure job. Clock is ticking...

And save the injury stuff - Buie is the ONLY one that the team has felt for the majority of the year. EP and Rok have been ONE game. NOT an excuse for the terrible display of ball we've seen all year.

The fact remains: JM and Co. have certainly turned this program around and provided some stability, very thankful for that - BUT they still have a LOT to prove 4 yrs in. Win without Green or a pro-point. And actually WIN IT ALL and go to the DANCE. Our conf mates do it. Still waiting for HU, so let's start there.
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